Saturday, July 14, 2012

EPISODE 72 - "NecroThinker: The Last Stand"

Not totally sure what was up with viewable/not-viewable earlier in the week, but now it's Saturday so here it is: The OFFICIAL rollout of our second big mailbag show AND (for those who stick around after the main show) the climax of the NecroThinker story-arc. Enjoy!



I'll be brutally honest: I'm not 100% satisfied with how everything came together on this one. The important stuff - the G1 Mailbag Questions - worked out just fine, but I had plans for the "battle" stuff that intercuts the questions and the big sendoff for NecroThinker that life just sort of got in the way of.

The main "bullet points" are all in there: Night-time sword fight, MOTU reference, reveal that OverThinker can use the two Stones the way he used Fire/Ice Flowers previously, turn RetroThinker back to normal but leave some doubt as to what degree the NecroThinker persona remains (or was always there) and - most-importantly - OverThinker deciding to keep NecroThinker's true identity a secret. So, structure-wise it does what was necessary.

My main regret is that I had wanted the actual fight to take place somewhere a little more visually-interesting than the abandoned parking-lot. Ideally I was hoping to find some kind of quarry/industrial location(s), but nailing one down that we could use, was reasonably safe and well-lit at night just never availed itself in the timeframe I wanted it to and the rest of my life got so consumed by bigger, more difficult things... so ultimately the best solution was to go with what we had on hand - especially since, after all, the skits are of secondary import to the "meat" of an episode; especially a Q&A.

As for where we go from here... still working that up. Unseen personal-apocalypses notwithstanding, the plan is to get these releases back on a more regular/reliable schedule. The next "arc" for the skits will likely begin pretty-much right away; but - without giving too much away - doesn't necessarily require as much direct involvement from The OverThinker himself or as much "on-location" shooting as this one did. I have a feeling people are going to dig some of the stuff that'll be showing up.

62 comments:

flamebreak said...

LOL
Nice Chaos Emerald replica things you got there. Which would mean there would actually be 7, but eh, who cares.
Interesting episode anyway. Some questions could do with a little elaboration with entire dedicated episodes. Ones like the universal multiplatform OS kind of thing.

Its an interesting idea, but it may result in consoles turning into Smartphones....

tehwaffleman said...

The way you "answered" the legitimate complaint about these live-action segments was incredibly immature, how exactly would removing these segments make the videos 'sub-par'? If you do it because you think it's fun says so, don't pretend that it adds anything to the thoughts or discussion you bring up. They are like Family Guy cutaway-gags, completely non sequitur.
There is already a edit up of ep 72 and the difference in time between the original and the edit is 7 MINUTES! That makes almost the half the episode nothing but self-indulgent filler. Even Linkara has learned to put his story segments after the credits as not to intrude on the actual main content of the show.
One of the mayor problems you have as an entertainer is that you so unable to receive and respond to criticism. I know you're not going to respond to this because "you already addressed it in the video". I complain because I think that these story segments are objectively bad for the overall video. Please either stop doing them or put them at the end. Also your intro is way to long and stop portraying yourself as 'the savior of videogames', you're not Captain N, just a portly dude who likes videogames a lot.

Anonymous said...

@tehwaffleman These are Bob's videos, not yours. He will direct them any which way he pleases. If you don't like the story segments just SKIP them.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous

Or watch the Game OverEditor videos on Blip with all the story portions cut out for your convenience.

(Granted Bob despises them, considering them inferior pirated bastardizations of his own work, but then again I'm sure George Lucas feels the same way about stuff like Star Wars Revisted, and I'd still sooner watch them than any of the special editions).

Redd the Sock said...

Actaully I thought he answered the question with the same maturity he normally receives the complaint: aka calling the story bits stupid and complaining that they exist. It makes sense to simply respond: no I think they're good (or as good as can be expected on this budget) and they're going to stay. Don't like them: skipping them is a mouse click and drag away. Myself, as lame as they can be, I do appriciate the effort to do more than just vent into a microphone. There are enough people on youtube doing that so it's good to see someone go the extra mile.

Myself, I'm not the argest fan of these mailbag shows as I find them too scattered on topics (maybe if they had a them to them os something), but nice to learn a few things. I'd like more startropics myself, especially thinking that it was one of the first games to break the digital forth wall with that letter, it could have a lot of fun with the 3DS' gimmicks.

Gus said...

I totally recognized the music you had playing during the battle as the theme to the first level of this classic Power Rangers game on the SNES. Awesome

Anonymous said...

To be fair, Bob is probably getting sick of all the complaints towards the story sections. As he mentioned in his last mailbag show, even though some people may not like the direction the show is taking, no one is going to like it if Bob suddenly becomes the "love me love me, I'll do whatever it takes for you to love me" kind of video creator.

Hell, Bob even moved the story elements to the end of each episode, in response to people's complaints, but people still feel the need to complain.

Also, the episode was a mailbag show and Bob answered questions. Is the fact he did so while fighting someone in a pretty cool swordfight really so horrible you're acting like it was physically hurting you?

biomechanical923 said...

@tehwaffleman

I share your sentiment.

Game Overthinker's original videos were nothing but a youtube slideshow with recorded audio of Bob actually talking about games

Way back when he first started tacking on the story shit, some listeners were asking if he would ever stop. At that point, Bob announced that he would NEVER make another video of the older format, and now we see him actually decrying that format as an "inferior product" which makes me think he has disappeared up his own ass.

The show is called "The Game Overthinker" and he doesn't even overthink things into elaborate detail anymore. Being relieved of the Youtube time constraints should have made the exposition and overthinking LESS concise, not more.

Megabyte said...

Honestly, I was ok with this... I kinda like the fictional world to go with the gaming points, to be honest. No, it's not the best quality video in the world, but eh... one guy and his immediate family may not have the resources to do that. I'll take it for what it is, enjoy it... and continue to give links from my own when I think it's worthy (for whatever reason). (In case you are wondering... it has happened once so far... the episode about historical gaming rang a VERY true bell to me)

Sabre said...

Megabyte- The problem is it HAS been done better. I think I mentioned it before, but there is an internet show called Pure Pwnage. It's a comedy show about a steriotypical RTS player called 'Teh Pwnerer'. All filmed by 2 guys and their friends. It's largely what Bob is pulling from, directly or not.

In episode 4 is starts to reveal that there is more going on, that skilled gamers are kind of like secret heros. 'Micro' is a power similar to the force, with styles like "console" and "arcade" which basicly involve miming using those controls. Weapons are stuff like Controllers and Keyboards. Watch episodes 4. There is a fight scene 15 minutes in.
http://youtu.be/CYe4lFaLIoA?t=15m20s
Overall, without any fancy effects, it is both more intense and entertaining. So saying "It's good for someone without many resources" doesn't really work.

People have done better, with less, and given how much he pulls from that show, he is still miles away.

Neon Superkill said...

@ Sabre - Your argument is flawed, Just because someone else can do it "better" doesn't mean that everyone else shouldn't try.

@ Everyone else - Bottom line. There are TONS of things on the internet to spend your time with. If you don't like something, don't watch it. Don't just whine about it every single time a new episode comes out. Just because YOU hate it doesn't mean everyone else does. Diversity keeps everything from being boring.

Sabre said...

Neon Superkill- It's not a case that he's trying, it's that they are bad. He knows people don't like it, so he holds the part of the show people do like to ransom.

There is no reason it can't be its own show. There is no reason he can't put it at the end of the show. There is no reason it can't be better.

Also, it is not different. Almost every other web show does it. Linkara, TGWTG, Pure Pwnage, Angry Nintendo Nerd to an extent. Even the original series of Arby 'n the Chief managed to mix rants with silly plot lines and be entertaining.

Specter Von Baren said...

I think the reason people have so much of a problem with the story segments here and not in things like Linkara's videos is because The Game Overthinker started out and is supposed to be more of a philosophical discussion on recent trends or past events or anything like that, while Linkara's show is supposed to be something funny where a person riffs on a comic book. How would you like it if you turned on the weather channel and the weatherman started tap dancing for three minutes before actually telling you whether it's going to rain? Even though it's just a few minutes, it constantly makes the viewer ask, "Why is this here?"

Look at how extra credits does it. They talk about stuff going on and while they do it they show you humorous and/or interesting pictures to with what they say but they never just go off the deep end and have the show be nothing but funny slides for several minutes.

And the thing is, if keeping up with all his shows is as hard as he says it is, then why does Bob keep doing these segments the require extra time to film and that most people don't seem to like anyway? Wouldn't it in fact make things easier for him to stop having them? The answer can't be that he wants to make a better product because the product he's selling is thinking and talking, not stories.

I'd be more than happy if Bob just kept Ivan and the commissioner in and used them to give brevity to the show throughout each episode but these story bits just seem to take time away from what people come here for which is to be educated in some way or at least make them think.

Sabre said...

Specter Von Baren- The weatherman thing is a good example, because if it was the weather followed by tap dancing, people wouldn't mind. If the tap dancing was a seperate show, people wouldn't mind.

The education/thinking point also raises an issue people have with some of his less popular episodes and posts. In the Mass Effect episodes, agree or disagree, his ignorance on the subject was cringe worthy. Sometimes it's just minor points.

Recently I started my own show which is a similar format to what you describe. It doesn't have many viewers yet.

Saarai'ari said...

Liked the answer to the question about the great decline and near elimination of the game rental market. Though I would probably like to see an Overthinker episode probably go further into the subject. I think it's a very important topic.

Anonymous said...

I think my problem with story segments is that oftetimes it´s just bad actors in silly costumes trying to do "EPIC!!!", while i don´t really care, because i came to watch a review or commentary.

The only ones that really get away with stuff like this, though more in the form of sketches, is Jontron and Redlettermedia, because they are genuinely funny. Don´t really care for any other reviewer og commentary guys sketches or storylines. Ofte i don´t get what it´s supposed to add, but when it´s kept short it´s often tolerable.

But in the GO show, it isn´t particularily funny to me and the segments are loooong... I really fail to see how it makes it a better show, because it doesn´t seem to add anything. You could remove the segments and the actual commentary would be the same...

Though i do like the videos where moviebob walks around while he talks intercut with slideshows. Why not more of that and less nostalgia worshipping storylines?

sorry, just my opinion.

Specter Von Baren said...

Sabre- I agree on the Mass Effect point. Reducing or removing the story elements would give him more time to work on the meat of the show and do more research into these things. If you want to make a show about discussion and thinking a better product then doing more research into the subjects you talk about would be how you improve it.

Aiddon said...

for what it's worth I didn't buy Fez because I found Phil Fish to be a colossal, insecure jackass. I love how he tried to defend his bullshit buy saying "yeah, well Jonathan Blow agrees with me!" What a baby

Sabre said...

Saarai'ari- The problem is there isn't really alot to say about it, and while I disagree with Bobs opinion on that particular subject (to me, it hasn't died, but rather changed).

The "go out and discover new games" idea is less about rentals, and more about the lack of information. Remember, when game rental was at its peak, there was no internet. Plus, if the blockbuster/global style rental market was still around today, the publishers would try and shut it down with DRM and DLC codes. It's not that different from the second hand market. A rental shop pays once for a game remember, with the long term profits going to the shop.

My pairents used to own a video rental place. They said they would pay £60 for a copy of Star Wars, but would make many times that back in the long run, if it was popular. There were times they would buy a film and never make a profit, so they had to pick and choose what films to get. The same "only get the sure thing" would still apply to games, so however you phrase it, this romantic view of rentals wouldn't work.

That said, I do think the "pop into blockbuster on the way home from school and get a game for the weekend" is a loss. But on the other hand, there were the times you would spend a weekend playing a game you didn't really like because there was nothing else to do.

Anonymous said...

Reasons why the stories need to end:

-They will drive away the fanbase. People signed on for the commentary, not the stories that literally add nothing to the show other than more time. I tried sticking with the show in spite of having to constantly skip the unnecessary bits, but found that I can't. I haven't watched an episode in ages, because I just can't deal with it anymore, and I'm sure many others can't, either.

-They make it impossible for new fans to start watching the show. New fans won't be able to 'get' what's going on unless they hunt down the beginning of each story, and they won't. The story will have no context for them and will come off as cheesy at least and stupid at most, made all the more aggravating that what the episode is supposed to be about is broken up by story bits that have nothing to do with the subject at hand. They won't be able to take the show seriously and will move on.

In short, these stories do nothing but drive away old fans and make it impossible for new fans to take the show seriously. The stories aren't just unnecessary, they're also harmful to the show.

And removing the stories wouldn't be the equivalent of saying 'love me, love me,' it would be showing professionalism. Real entertainers listen to criticism so they can modify their work to make it a better product. People have already explained why the stories made the Overthinker show an inferior product, and Bob not listening isn't him being smart, it's showing contempt. It's what HE and ONLY HE wants to do; there's no other reason for them to exist.

I hate to say it, Bob, but you're dangerously close to becoming people like Tim Buckley or Tom Preston (who I believe was an avid follower of your show at one point, ironically enough; I believe he was a huge Other M fan, too): a person who's literally incapable of listening to criticism, either because your ego has inflated so much or because you know you have a die-hard section of the fanbase that will defend and praise anything and everything you do.

Anonymous said...

The thing I actually miss most was when Bob used to overthink the small trivial stuff. One of my favorite episodes was Daisy Daisy, where he explored relationships in the video game world. But now these days, it seems like all the show wants to do is explore hot button issues so he can give his (very opinionated) opinion inter-cut with cheesy fight scenes.

As a former fan, I just feel kinda sad that he considers those old videos as an inferior product.

Specter Von Baren said...

To the previous poster- And the thing is that there's nothing really wrong with him doing story stuff or wanting to do it because he likes to do it. It's how he keeps trying to justify it that really gets to me.

Anonymous said...

I can't believe you guys are still whining about this after almost two years.

Anonymous said...

@Anon
I can't believe you are still watching this trip for two years.

Anonymous said...

Really, still after all this time it's still nothing but complaints about the story. Guys just get the hell over it already! It's not even funny to read these comments anymore.

Evilkinggumby said...

Hmm.. as lot of you guys don't like elements of the cideo's and complain about them.. regularly..almost obsessively at points. I figured I'd point something out to some of the commentors to explain why they're shouts are not being "heard" and to those who want to legitimately try and help..

stop posting anonymously. Take a moment, even if it is while atching Bob's video's , to set up or link SOME type of account to this blog so that you can actually build up a rapport with both Bon and everyone here. Without having a unique and identifiable name attached, all you are is a faceless stranger walking up to bob and saying what you think. He has no way of knowing if every anonymous is a new person, a dozen people, or a hundred people. Yes he may have IP logging butc'mon.. that is a tool for banning people, not figuring out who said what.

Think of it like this... who do you think an entertainer is going to really listen to and consider, a person walking up after the show, introducing themselves, and having a conversation(and possibly doing so several times over the months) or someone in the back, invisible in the crowd shouting "you suck!" ?

Stopping to insult, whine, flame, or generally criticise him without taking any time to at least identify yourself doesn't really warrant him to take the time to address, consider or challenge what was said. If some stranger says "fuck you" behind my back and vanishes before I can see them, I am not going to give their opinion much cause for reflection. I'm going to assume they were just some jackhole and forget they ever existed.

I think some of what has been said has legitimate cause for consideration. But even if Bob did this and did an episode that talked about comments and fans, every other complain would be "Anonymous says.." and "Anonymous asks". I suspect this is also why he only answered questions for mailbag on Screwattack, because THEN he knows he'll get real names.

I almost want bob to turn off the anonymous option if possible just to help align the issue and better connect with his viewers and fans. He supposedly reads ALL the comments on here (if possible) so... maybe he'll read this.. maybe he won't.

Personally I don't mind the skits in his videos. I have accepted the general schlock low budget cinema feel they have and almost want him to amplify it a bit more and really make it terrible. It seems like his skits are a running social commentary on gaming and the topic at hand, but in a lot of cases they're so detached or vague/symbolic most folk won't "get" it. and yet, bob still loves doing it, so really, he doesn't care if people don't always get it. He is still enjoying what he does, expressing himself artistically in a way that he finds fulfilling, and so he considers what he does to be "superior" than say, old videos where he was uncomfortable/unable to do so. I can honestly say I wouldn't be surprised if it took a lot of mental fortitude for him to actually "be" in his videos because he is not charles atlas. Not to say he is a total toad, but c'mon.. when you look in the mirror and know you won't fit the prime standard for looks and sexiness, it hurts and you're more inclined to do video blogs with pictures and not so much face. I actually think it is kool he does all these skits, many of which are fairly physical, and puts himself out there for people to see, insults and compliments et al. At least you see him for who he is and not some anonymous faceless tag throwing stones from the safety of a quiet dark bedroom...

James said...

Bob, you didn't answer my question so I'll ask it again - why do you act like the only representatives of Modern gaming are military FPS and sports games? Why do you ignore the action titles, RPG titles, indie hits, revival of point-and-click adventures, ect?

Anonymous said...

To all the people who say people don't like the story segments and are bad. Speak for yourselves. I personally enjoy them, and I think they have improved by miles since The Antithinker first appeared and are only getting better. All your bitching just comes across as immature and pointless. You are obviously still watching the videos, you obviously still like watching Bob do his thing, and all the story segments are cut to the back of the episodes now so you can just turn the god damn thing off when the meat of the episodes are done.

I love what your doing Bob, and the fact that you are trying to flex your creative muscles and really try something else and bring more to the show is fantastic. While I disliked the story segments at first, they have gotten far better and have grown on me tremendously, to the point I would be upset if you stopped doing them and let all of the questions currently in the show unanswered. Keep Overthinking, and keep making a wonderful fantasy world. Your videos are like the great fantasy epics of the 80's, cheesy, but endearing.

Anonymous said...

Whoever serves your videos, they want me to allow cross-site flash scripts from gorillanation dot com. (Do not actually visit that website. They have been accused of installing malware on users' machines in the past. WOT page here: https://www.mywot.com/en/scorecard/gorillanation.com)

I know you can't control who advertises on your videos, but you can do the following:

- Let your corporate masters at Springboard know that one of their advertising partners, gorillanation, has been flagged as a known malware distributor, and that if this is true, you consider it a problem.

- Look for an alternative method of distributing your videos.

- Talk to any friends you may have who also distribute videos on the internet and ask them what they know about this issue.

- Do your own research. Find out more about Web-of-Trust and hpHosts (the malware blacklist that initially fingered them.) Question everything I've said here. Ask Springboard and GorillaNation for comment. I know you'd do this anyway, because you have basic worldly critical thinking skills, but it bears repeating for the benefit of others who might read this post.

Why is this important? Because if gorillanation really does distribute malware, it means your videos could potentially be installing viruses on every machine that visits your website.

Thanks, and keep fighting the good fight. (I'm assuming you won-- I still can't view it.)

alexandrite said...

"I don't like the story scenes, so I am entitled to not see them without having to move my fat, greasy hand to my mouse."

~ tehwaffleman

alexandrite said...

Also, I personally laughed at the icebob/firebob costume change. I don't typically watch the story sections myself, but that amused me for some reason.

Chazz said...

"Dear Bob
I am a lazy and hateful ingrate who likes to complain about the quality of a completely free show that I apparently still watch even though I profess to hating it. Now sit back and listen to how I, a random anon, can make your show better. All you have to do is remove all the funny and creative bits. Turn it into a generic and boring rant about videogames. Reduce it to the level of some guy hollering his opinions into a mic, so that way it will be easier for brainless morons to stomach. Clearly this formula has worked for people like Limbaugh, so it should work for you!"
Seriously though Bob, as much hate as you seem to get for the story segments, you DO have viewers who enjoy them, and I for one am glad that you've kept them around. I especially liked the explosions every time the swords clashed, because it reminded me of how sparks would fly out of the power rangers every time they got punched by the bad guys. In any case, can't wait to see how the next arc turns out. Keep up the good work!
(Oh, and I'm calling it right now, the wind gem is gonna be green, because wind is green.
tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WindIsGreen)

Lazy Lantern said...

not 1 more, 2
wind and Heart!

Anonymous said...

LOL at people defending his story telling segments.

Haven't you seen his view count? Its gone completly down hill. The majority of thumbed up comments on his youtube episodes are comments telling when to skip the storytelling. If its still being brought up two years later and his viewership has greatly decreased, guess what, ITS STILL A PROBLEM.

What your encouraging him to keep doing is becoming a washed up hack. Your acting exactly like legenday frog's fanbase ""Oh its ok you make poorly made animation! Surely there won't be other more talented animators to come along and take your audiance away!"" *egoraptor/happy harry/oneyg *SMASH*

Guess what it already has happened. There are already much more popular and viewed channels on youtube than moviebob who talk about videogames, comics, cinema than him (classic game room, alphaomegasin, johntron) jesus even razorfist rageholic is growing and passed a million and is doing exactly what moviebob use to do.

You blew it Bob, you could of being bigger if you listened to your audiance but you won't be since you and your niche fanbase refuse to listen to reason.

Anonymous said...

@Chazz

You know, it really says something about a show called the GameOVERTHINKER when you can say something like "I LIKE THE EXPLOSIONS CAUSE THEY REMIND ME OF POWERRANGERS" and then link to TVTROPES for "story speculation".

Bob, if you like making those story segments, fine.

But at least be honest. If we're analyzing your show as a product...corporate would have KILLED the guy that suggested "story" segments for your show.

Chazz said...

@The anon who just replied to me

I'm assuming when you said "it really says something", what you meant is "it really says something awesome". Because Power Rangers was a great show, and TVTropes is a great site, so you couldn't possibly be implying something negative with that statement.

And quite frankly, it's just plain silly to analyze the show as a product. Bob has said several times that the Game Overthinker, being the show he has the most creative control over, is the one he likes to just have fun with. It's the show where he can have schlocky visual effects, cheesy one-liners, rapid-fire references to geek culture, and hard-bitten police commissioners played by adorable bunny rabbits. It is, first and foremost, the show where Bob can enjoy making something that the audience will enjoy, not because it makes us think or talks about important topics, (Though it certainly does do both of those as well) but simply because it's just plain good-ol' fashioned fun.
That's part of why I brought up the Power Rangers. Neither show has perfect visual effects, neither show has the most believable acting. Both shows can be immensely cheesy at points. And both shows are just so darn much fun that I completely forgive them for their inadequacies and like them all the more for trying so hard.
If you aren't one of the people who enjoys the story segments, fair enough. Nobody's saying you have to. But don't try and pretend like the Game Overthinker would be made better by their removal, because it wouldn't.
The Overthinking part of the show is the cake. The story segments are simply icing on top. Sure, cake is edible without icing, but I can't understand picking icingless cake when the alternative tastes so much better.
...Hmm, you know, I WAS gonna continue the metaphor with something along the lines of "have your cake and eat it too" but I think I've made my point. Long story short, Bob likes the story bits, there's certainly an audience for the story bits (which I am quite obviously a part of), so, basically, what it comes down to is "The story segments are here to stay until further notice, so either get used to it or try not to rag on them so much. Or stop watching the show."

jackspicer88 said...

I'm with Chazz with this one. But the example I going to say was that I liked Moviebob's story bits in a "Hardware Wars" kinda way.

It's cheesy yet funny.

Anonymous said...

"But don't try and pretend like the Game Overthinker would be made better by their removal, because it wouldn't."


Really? Its THAT unbelievable that the show would be better if Bob didnt try to act like a "ThatGuyWithTheGlasses"-wannabe? That the game overthinker stick to a formula that made people take him (and by extension his points) more seriously than all the other guys talking about games on the internet?

The thing about seeing it as a product is because thats the term that Bob put it in.
He thinks it a superior product simply because he puts more effort in it.

But its not. Even if a product has massive amounts of effort put into it, it doesnt matter when the majority didnt want it in the first place.

People came to the gameoverthinker for the OVERTHINKING on videogames.
Pretty sure when most of us were voting for him on Screwattack, it wasnt because of amazing special effects, tear jerking story lines, and high caliber acting.

It isnt a superior product if the best you can say to justify this addition, is "IF YOU DONT LIKE IT THEN JUST/SKIP/IGNORE/PUT UP WITH IT"
Its just a product with a useless addition that takes more time/effort to produce.

alexandrite said...

"But at least be honest. If we're analyzing your show as a product...corporate would have KILLED the guy that suggested "story" segments for your show."

That's a big "if." There's no corporate dude around to can people for this sort if thing because this is almost all Bob's show. Why do you feel entitled to a corporate quality filter in front of your content producers? Why do you feel like Bob is somehow obligated to format his show according to your idea of quality?

I'm not standing up for Bob, I'm standing up for everyone who's sick of the arrogant self-entitlement this have-it-your-way service industry has bred into our society.

Anonymous said...

@alexandrite

So is that how its gonna be?
Any artistic criticism shared by the majority of an audience is ENTITLEMENT? That an artist should never listen to actual feedback?

Its not like anybody is pointing a gun at Bobs head to force him to stop making skits.

But people have stopped watching him, and those that have stayed voiced that the problem is probably those segments. Its a legitimate issue.

And the best that other people (and seemingly Bob)can tell those people who have stayed...is to move on or just ignore it.
And that doesnt solve the problem.
So people keep bringing it up again in the hopes that Bob might ACTUALLY address it.

Its not like theres people filing a class action suit against Bob or something. They're doing what Bob has allowed them to do, which is voice their issues in the comments, or just stop watching him all together.
The fact that people ARE still complaining shows its a serious issue.

And Bob can continue to ignore them....forever if he wants to. He can change to show to a 45 minute shot of paint drying on a wall. He has the power to and no ones denying that.

But Im pretty sure you'd suddenly find the comments filled with way more "entitled baby whining" if he pulled something like that.

Anonymous said...

I´d say the show would be better without the story segments, because they really don´t seem to add anything to the commentary and i don´t find them particularily funny. I´m either hoping that one day, they will be gone or that one day, the quality will improve, cause right now i´m slowly losing interest in the show. I check back less and less regularily as time goes on.

The only shows where i like the skits are in Redlettermedias Half in the bag episodes and Jontrons videos, because they are pretty damn funny. I know it´s a free show, but i´m still expecting some sort of quality, or atleast signs of improvement. I see neither for the time being...

- Baskerville

Evilkinggumby said...

"So is that how its gonna be?
Any artistic criticism shared by the majority of an audience is ENTITLEMENT? That an artist should never listen to actual feedback? "

LOL when it is feedback that is akin to a faceless member of the crowd shouting "get off the stage, you suck! you're not funny! I hate your material!" then yeah, I think an artist will generall ignore the heckling and has every reason to. I can understand CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM falling within the realm of your argument, but almost every person i've seen saying the skits should be cut isn't actually saying anything constructive aside from omitting them entirely and that they're not funny. Very few, if anyone, has actually given constructive feedback that breaks down the details and tries to bring a conversation to the table about where it falls, why, and what steps could be taken to improve it. Instead he is hearing shouted opinions and sorry but most artists will tell you that someone's opinion is NOT constructive criticism.

I mean, ok, let's be constructive here. I don't think he should lose the skits, but ways to make them better might be to get more up to date equipment so that it is less blurry/grainy. get a proper lighting rig for outdoor/nighttime shots so they looks less murky. Set up multiple camera's to allow for more cuts and angles in the scene. Using more sophisticated after effects software to step up some small details. or to start a kick starter to let fans HELP fund implementing those many things.

As well analyzing the story in general and why it is weak or falling flat. I have seen a few people talk about the actual plot and characters, and THAT is helpful, because it is more than just "it stinks". It is cognitive analysis of his work and an attempt to both interpret and understand it and try to make it better.

but yeah rallying behind the mob of anonymous posters saying " we no likey" is not going to be considered, especially when you consider how easily people can troll and insult and flame on the internet without any care or legitimate concern.

OH HEY CHECK IT OUT I HAVE AN IDENTITY NOW said...

Why does it matter so much that a blogger id be necessary?
Its not like they matter when most of the people dont have blogs and only use the id to leave comments anyways. And its not like we know Bob on a personal basis. And stupid google id is ultimately just the same thing as being anonymous, just having another useless id and password to remember.

Besides removing the skits is a constructive criticism. People arent shooting down Bobs work as a whole, just this specific part.
The improvement IS the omission.
Without these skits, Bob can have more time to spend on the core aspect of the show. There can be more Gameoverthinking.

If a comedian keeps telling the same bad jokes over and over again, it doesnt help if you say "Oh maybe you should tell those jokes while wearing a fake mustache and yelling really loudly". The better advice is to tell him to simply not use them.

Even the people who like the story know that he's not going to have TV budget effects.
Discussing the technical quality is pointless, because what matters more is if these stories are even really wanted in the first place.

People have already constructively stated that they dont add much to the show, and just make him seem like a derivative of other reviewers who handled the same concept better.

Ralphael said...

Story still sucks ass Bob, and the reason i'm letting you know because I actually give enough of a shit to type out that I still hate it.

Ralphael said...

@Evilkinggumby This isnt a stage, this is the comments section where people are SUPPPOSED to give feedback of the video. You're pretty shitty at analogies. Give up.

Anonymous said...

To the people demanding the story be removed, You're the only ones who give a shit and therefore it's not happening.

To the people defending the story, You're not helping.

Now can we talk about something that actually matters?

Evilkinggumby said...

@Raphael- Nah I won't give up, but I won't entertain trolls like you who really offer nothing to any conversations.

Hey Bob, got any new posts to hint at what we're going to be expecting next time? :) If you donated to the Tropes Vs Women kickstarter you linked a while ago, I'd be interested to see what else you might offer in the realm of that. It is still a hotbutton topic and I'd love to see your take on the whole thing (not to mention the slew of hate and attention you may get for it). If needed I have a number of links to articles and videos in relations to the topic and girl gamers in general if you are interested. :)

Specter Von Baren said...

Maybe this is all a chicken and egg sort of problem. Are we really sure that the quality of the shows has gone down because of the story skits? What if it's the other way around and the quality of the show has dropped, the overthinking and interesting topics, and so Bob has turned to making story skits to make up for the decrease in quality?

Anonymous said...

""Maybe this is all a chicken and egg sort of problem. Are we really sure that the quality of the shows has gone down because of the story skits? What if it's the other way around and the quality of the show has dropped, the overthinking and interesting topics, and so Bob has turned to making story skits to make up for the decrease in quality?""

The core aspect of his show is the gameoverthinking,that keeps getting interrupted by these film segments, no need to denie it, if his letting the main aspect of the show go to waste with spending more time trying to pad the show than actually research the subject and make a more compelling episode. Then the whole show like an apple will rot inside out.

Which is exactly happened. Look at another example of another videogame commentators doing exactly moviebob use to do and still continues with the same constant formula. Extra Credits. There now on PENNY-ARCADE they in fact moved UP to more popular websites over the years and not once did they change there formula. At all.

Go to youtube look at the older game overthinkers and look at the views and the comments, over time you'll see a clear pattern when the story came in, the show went down massively in popularity and the majority of the comments will tell you, the story is the problem.

Most thumbed up comment on his first episode...

""Bob should really re-watch the first 16 seconds of this video.""

Its clear as day what the problem is, Bob had a formula that worked, but he didn't seize the opportunity to harness what worked for him.

He could of saved some money over time, bought illustrator/photoshop for cleaner image to make or edit, a better mike, better film editing software, maybe even talked to some artists who are fans of him to get some art for his screencards, panels.

That way over time he could spend more time researching his subject and give a well thought out subject and executed video instead of...

""So now to talk about the current video game industry....whats this? NINJAS!""

Then we are interrupted, with badly performed choregraphed fight scene between two overweight guys and has nothing to do with the subject discussed at all. Its frankly childish and I expect better from an adult.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous,
And I expect better spelling and better sources than youtube comments from a critic that keeps claiming they're a professional.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous

There's nothing in the comment above, where the poster is claiming to be a professional anything.

So you have to be a professional now to suggest improving apon what works? I thinks thats the whole point of their comment considering they used extra credits as an example also.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous,
*upon *think. Also including Extra credits doesn't change the fact that your other source is still youtube comments.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous

""*upon *think. Also including Extra credits doesn't change the fact that your other source is still youtube comments.""

Any criticism is valuable.

Especially on the third most visited website, third largest community and the biggest audience for Moviebob.

Or maybe the fact that Moviebob begged this exact audience with ""VOTE FOR ME!"" videos during the my videos don't suck contest and it was this audience that helped him get noticed.

Chazz said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Chazz said...

"Maybe this is all a chicken and egg sort of problem. Are we really sure that the quality of the shows has gone down because of the story skits? What if it's the other way around and the quality of the show has dropped, the overthinking and interesting topics, and so Bob has turned to making story skits to make up for the decrease in quality?"

The problem with your argument is that it presupposes that the quality of the show has decreased, which, in fact, it hasn't. The content, style, and direction might have all changed to varying degrees, but the quality itself, of the writing, execution, and show as a whole, hasn't changed. At least, it hasn't changed for the worse.

"over time you'll see a clear pattern when the story came in, the show went down massively in popularity and the majority of the comments will tell you, the story is the problem."

I love how you're implying that there's a direct correlation between popularity and quality. Jersey Shore, Justin Bieber, and McDonalds are all terrible, TERRIBLE products that still somehow manage to remain popular. By the same token, being unpopular doesn't necessarily mean that something is bad.

This is not something you payed for. This is not a product that Bob has to tailor to your every whim simply because you deign to watch it. If you have an negative opinion about the way the show is going, fair enough, its the interwebz, we're all about freedom of expression. Just don't expect anyone to take you seriously when you're using youtube trolls as your cited sources.

Anonymous said...

@chaz

"" I love how you're implying that there's a direct correlation between popularity and quality. Jersey Shore, Justin Bieber, and McDonalds are all terrible, TERRIBLE products that still somehow manage to remain popular. By the same token, being unpopular doesn't necessarily mean that something is bad.""

Popularity and quality do have a direct correlation. Why? Because its what the audience chooses. You may not like it (neither do I) but those three examples you brought up make millions of dollars and keep there audience. The audience is a customer, the customer is always right.

Being unpopular means it can't keep or generate an audience. I bet you the majority of anything you liked or enjoyed were popular, no shame in admitting it. Were all consumers.

Moviebob uses this show to try and convince us to pay money to get a screwattack account to watch this also.

How is he going to convince people to pay when he can't even keep a audience watching when its free?


""
This is not something you payed for. This is not a product that Bob has to tailor to your every whim simply because you deign to watch it. If you have an negative opinion about the way the show is going, fair enough, its the interwebz, we're all about freedom of expression. Just don't expect anyone to take you seriously when you're using youtube trolls as your cited sources.""

So who's sources would you trust or take seriously? Most likely no one because ANY criticism can just be called trolling because its easy to do rather than actually dealing with it.

What about the comments here? What about the ones on screwattack too?

All trolls right? Or maybe, just maybe considering after two years the people who do tell Bob these things could actually be FANS?

Ok, cut out the youtube argument, what about the rest?

Oh right no one wants to argue the drop off in views, similar shows doing what bob did became much more successful or the fact the story segments are still argued over two years later because it would have to break the imaginary rule of you can't criticise something that's free...

Even though its used to promote buying a membership for a website...

Or most likely everyone else has done so for anything else free, ever.

Anonymous said...

The problem isn't that popularity isn't important it's that by now the complaints are just annoying. In a different example look at Star Wars, First there's some edits made to the original and the prequels are made, because of these there were legit complaints for a few years. But by now, about a decade later it's just sad to see people still ranting about how Phantom Menance and Greedo shooting first ruined their lives. And like in that case you can complain and claim it's the worst thing ever all you damn want, but what the director chose to do is what's happening. And if in all honesty after two whole years of this you're still ranting about how much you hate the story then go ahead, because by now just about nobody will listen to you anyway.

Anonymous said...

But BoB just bought it up in the video again, if there´s a time to complain, it´s now^^.

But yeah, people should just stop watching, the story isn´t going to improve or go away. Personally i´m done, no more. There´s plenty of consistently good video game shows, so i can´t see why i should continue watching this one.

Aiddon said...

oh yeah, I also remembered that there was a Professor Layton animated movie that was released in the US that was actually GOOD.

Smashmatt202 said...

FINALLY got around to watching these episodes. Vacations and other obligations and whatnot.

Shoot, I like the explosion effects coming from the blades hitting! And I'm speaking genuinely!

The frick? He's answering them WHILE he's battling? I wonder, will this go somewhere, like, will answering these questions help shake the Retrothinker out of the Necrothinker?

Also, the music in the background makes it a little hard to hear the questions and answers. Not too much, just a bit harder to comprehend sometimes. FYI for future mailbag question episodes.

Boy let me tell you, I sure do miss renting games. Like, I'd get me mom to take me to Blockbuster all the freaking time to rent games. Now they're basically gone, so now it's like we have to go in blind. Demos help, but I miss actually RENTING games, then deciding upon the experience whether or not I should buy it... It really is tragic. ;'(

Sometimes I contemplate what "innovative" actually means. I hear it tossed around a lot, but I don't really understand what it's supposed to imply. Also, yes, we've seen more then enough "outlandish" and "off-beat" games, to the point where I feel like I'm actually as interested in games that sell themselves on their weird sensibilities as I am in the brown/gray FPS...

Yeah, the thing about forums and communities is that most of them are FULL of assholes, so when you try to stop them from being assholes, everyone gangs up on your instead. That being said, I feel obliged to call someone out on being a dick when it's not on YouTube, though even then I tend to open that can of worms...

Oh yeah, Fez... That game did NOT interest me at all. Yeah, Phil's anti-Japanese comments didn't help, but at the same time, this didn't seem to interest me as much as Braid or Cave Story did (oh shit, Overthinker said those games as well, HA!)

that PS3 talk reminds me of what Jim Sterling said in a recent Jimquisition, e.i. Sony needs to stop making excuses and fucking COMPETE in a competitive market. Yeah, it seems for too long, Sony had too many lucky breaks which let to a bit of undeserved self-intitlement, and it's come to bite them in the ass.

Smashmatt202 said...


You know, I actually don't mind the stupid storylines. I'm actually having fun picking them apart, and with some recent learning experiences (thanks in part to the My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic brony community), I've learned to be less hateful and more constructive with what I don't like about these videos... Hopefully.

I love Game Boy games. Backwards compatibility should come with ALL next gen games. I mean, sure, later versions of the DS didn't play Game Boy, or even Gamy Boy Advance games, but yet, by THAT point, you already HAD a ton of systems that did!

StarTropics FTW! Yeah, Balloon Fight or Devil World might be interesting, but come on, guys, STARTROPICS!!! ...Yeah, a beatable version would be nice.

I'm glad Bob gave us a straight answer when it came to Bunnyface.

...I miss Borders, Blockbuster, and Circuit City... Like seriously, I went to those places all the time. I go to Barnes & Noble now, and I GUESS I'll have to make do with Circuit City... I don't think I've heard of Suncoast, though...

I like what Bob said about Nintendo being "dragged out of the console market". Out of all the video game companies out there, Nintendo has ALWAYS been the last to change or "catch up" with the rest. Hell, I think Nintendo once said that if they ever stopped making consoles, they'd stop making games period. I don't know if they'll actually make good on that threat, though, only time will tell.

Yeah, I WOULD say show the Necrothinker Sonic Generations, but yeah, I think he's beyond saving at this point...

Overthinker wielding dual ice and fire powers is just badass. I'd love to see some kind of matchup between another Internet personality that can fight!

"HOORAY, THAT WORKED FOR SOME REASON!" I love how Ivan states what's on all of our minds.

"Earth magic" huh? What next, a wind stone? And a HEART stone? XP

Say, are we going to see Bob's brother more in this series, I actually liked seeing him at the beginning and end of the Antithinker saga.

So yeah, good episode, IMO.

HarivanshRai Bachchan said...

I hope this movie was smartly made. Arnold is too old to rely on his presence anymore. I am glad to read the review which reflects movie’s correct way to use Arnold and made it entertaining. I can’t wait to see it now.